Charles Denton "Tex" Watson...The Man Behind The Monster Part Four - The Interviews, Part H



Courtesy both photos Rolling Stone

In Charles Denton “Tex” Watson…The Man Behind The Monster

Part Four – The Interviews, Part A, Part B, Part C, Part D, Part E, Part F, Part G

I continue to dissect and differentiate between what Tex says from what he truly means. In today’s Part H – The Victims, we see how ingrained his sociopathic behaviour is.

In life, when normal people respond to questions, truth is backed by genuine feelings from the heart. And then there's rote regurgitation masked as the truth with sociopaths. Charles "Tex" Watson is stellar at the latter.

In this interview, as in every other one he has ever participated in, Tex has the Bible thumping truisms down to perfection, no matter the question posed.

Too bad it's all just spewed con artistry.

The first question out of the gate was this, "Let's talk about the victims. What do you think has caused you to feel the way you do today?"

Tex grinds out;

"It takes the Spirit of God to produce empathy — a capacity for experiencing the feelings and thoughts of others."

Crikey. It's like Tex was given a text book on how to be human and he memorized it like a theology student would a religious text.

He literally blames God here if you read between the lines. He's saying God didn't produce empathy in him so he was helpless. He had to become a cold-hearted killer. That's not only blatantly wrong, it's blasphemous.

Humans are born from God (if you have a spiritual background) but they have Free Will. They make choices.

Choices, Tex. You ever heard of that word???

Along our life path, we come to many forks in the road—one way is good, the other bad. If you're inclined to be wholly egocentric and narcissistic, you'll choose the bad IF it gets you what you want, faster, easier.

In Tex's youth, he did this. From little things back home in Copeville, Texas to when the stakes got seriously high, from drug dealing, theft and eventually murder in L.A. Former jailer at the Collin County Prison, Bob King, intimates Tex got into “trouble” at home and that’s what made him vamoose from Texas and hightail it for California. It’s obvious that the criminal mindset was well developed in Tex well before he ever set a foot in So Cal.

I suspect deviant ways began early in childhood, as nothing stops a narcissistic personality. In other words, Tex had no innate stop gaps like the rest of us do who have a conscience when it came to taking the wrong path in life. He used his reactionary frontal lobe to decide his next move, and all moves would align with his desires, and if people got in the way, they became collateral damage. Simple as that.

The only thing that changed over time was the escalation of those choices.

Tex states that "I broke" after he read in Bugliosi's Helter Skelter when Vincent writes that Steve Parent's mother became hysterical after viewing her son at the morgue.

I want to ask Tex, How? How did you break? And Why? For the victim and his family? Or for yourself?


He states that he rejected help from psychiatrists and drugs and instead gravitated to Christians who were reaching out to him. Why, you ask? Simple. A sociopath's single skill is manipulation. Tex had no control over psychiatrists or drugs but he could control unknowing people, especially those who already had a soft spot towards him. And he calculated that if he got them on his side, maybe that wave of sympathy would eventually unlock his prison door and return his freedom. All sociopaths think they will outsmart the authorities, that they will be found innocent and set free. They have no ability to see fault in their actions, so they surmise, why should anyone else?

What we do know from court and prison records is that Tex had a nervous breakdown and spent considerable time at Atascadero State (Mental) Hospital. He wouldn’t eat, lost a lot of weight and for a time was considered catatonic. Could it have all been an act? Sure. He had this breakdown shortly after extradition from Texas to California. Notice how he didn’t break down while still being held in Texas. Nope. The closer he got to San Quentin’s Green Room by way of an L.A. trial, the more he magically lost it. If his breakdown was genuine, you can be sure it was NOT because of his sorrow for the victims. It was due to loss of face, self-image, reputation, control and power.

In this first question, Tex NEVER mentions any of the victims by name. He only mentions his plight. Just like with co-killer, Patricia Krenwinkel, when asked in one of her parole hearings who the main victim was in all of this, she said it was herself. Tex is doing the very same thing here. Sociopaths are completely incapable of seeing others in their mind. They can spew memorized, canned responses to feign caring and empathy, but when asked to offer true feelings about their victims, the conversation always reverts back to themselves.

Tex saw God as his “Get Out of Jail Free card.” He was told God forgives but he blithely ignored what man has to do to be forgiven. Tex sees himself as being completely absolved of all guilt in those murders, and has about as much emotional investment in them as someone who slaps paint over rotten wood to hide the rot. Susan Atkins took this stance, too, and both, once they thought this was a legitimate out, never looked back and forevermore had that frontal lobotomy blissful glow of innocence.

According to Tex, it was May of 1975 when he dropped his guilt. For 7 spent lives, he breathed a form of guilt for 4 years. That's roughly 6 months mental incarceration for each victim; Steve Parent, Voytek Frykowski, Jay Sebring, Abigail Folger, Leno and Rosemary LaBianca. A disgustingly infinitesimal amount of time. Since then, his life behind bars has been a mental lark.

I’m always inclined to proverbially ask this question of prison Bible thumpers, aka jailhouse believers: If God is the answer why didn't you try to find Him BEFORE you committed murder??? Even if you didn't know He existed (and Tex did know as he came from a devout church-going family, attending in his youth the Copeville Community Methodist Church,
Courtesy Will You Die For Me?
why didn't you try and seek help so you wouldn't harm others? Of course, one is always met with silence as the fast life was what counted before they got caught. Jesus only pops into their head when they have nothing better going on behind cell doors.

Tex further states that, "...that every life--man, woman and child...is of enormous value in His eyes," never mentioning that Tex should value people as God does. Tex admits that, "This thought was entirely missing at the time of my crime, even though my mother had tried to teach me to live for others."

This statement is huge.

It could indicate that his mother had seen deviant tendencies in her boy early on, of him caring more for himself than others, of committing deviant acts to get his way, and she feared that behaviour would grow. Tex's parents were very fine, hardworking people and I'm sure they laid awake at night concerned about their son's callous behaviour. Antisocial Personality Disorder, the clinical term of sociopathy in DSM-5, usually begins to manifest itself in the early years but acting out may not occur until the teenage or young adult years, making Tex's sociopathic timeline spot on. If ASPD people always get what they want when they want it, they may have no desire to harm others. It’s when any obstacle comes in their way, then slashing away that obstacle, human or otherwise, is the default reaction in a sociopathic mind.

Tex refers to the seven murders as "my crime." He’s white washing over his heinous acts to sterilize himself from them, packaging them in a neat dissociative box to avoid getting too close to the reality and having to admit fault and feel fault. He doesn't personalize the victims or use active verbs to describe what he did to them. They are simply, "my crime." This is just another tiny clue that indicates that Tex has never emotionally dealt with his actions and that all his so-called grieving and regret has been for show.

Once in prison, Tex admits that he "...was concerned that I didn't know how to feel about my victims' deep pain..." Concerned. Wow. That's the understatement of the 20th century! This is why ASPD is NOT a diagnosis of insanity. All sociopaths KNOW Right from Wrong, they just refuse to see what they're doing as wrong. You can bet your bottom Greenback that Tex damn well knew driving up to Cielo that sweltering August night was wrong but he did it because his well-being was paramount. His tail was in a crack from the drug deal gone wrong with Lotsapoppa. He knew they needed to get out of town ASAP, so Tex knew money was top priority. If he could placate Manson with his revenge fantasy and get the loot they needed to hide out at Barker, then getting hopped up on Speed and slicing through a few Beautiful People up in Benedict was okay by him. Tex only felt "concerned" once it behooved him to, for his own sake.

He claims an "us and them syndrome" only developed in him while being around Manson. That is true to the extent that Charlie had always fostered that belief in The Family. Yet, Tex knew this of Charlie right from Day One, well before he was All-In at Spahn’s Ranch and while he was still living in that Hollywood apartment with his on again/off again girlfriend to pursue odd jobs and a lofty career as a small-time pot dealer. Tex had countless chances to walk away from Manson. Tex CHOSE to stay. No gun was ever put to his head.

Tex won't "go there" for the interviewer in terms of how he truly felt or feels today toward his victims. He reverts back to his rote responses, never letting down his guard, never saying in plain language what he did and never admitting how truly horrific those details are. A sociopath can never "go there" because they have no genuine feelings for others. Tex will have a soft spot for his parents only because he knew they loved him and gave him what he wanted and for his children who, to Tex, are just lovely reflections of himself, but everyone else may as well be made out of cardboard. He feels no genuine connection to any other person.

Tex says he sought out God, "so I could be healed." I. Me. Mine. Never a mention of how he could and should heal others. We all will immediately think of the victims and their family members but that thought will never be automatic to Tex.

Tex further states, "...guilt robs a person of their future. He has removed those chains. I've come to understand that Christ came to free us of our guilt."

This statement would be laughable if the circumstances of his actions were not so horrible. Tex found a "loophole" in God and he's sticking to it. Tex has conveniently warped God's purpose and spends his life with that frontal lobotomy smile that only comes from ignorant bliss. It makes me cringe to think that idiot was allowed conjugal visits. It must have given Doris Tate nightmares. At least Doris eventually got the law overturned, bless her heart. Watson nor any of the Manson killers, nor any killer period should be allowed to profit from their deeds, nor should Tex have a mental "out" of any kind. But there you have it, folks. You slaughter in ’69 and fool around in a conjugal trailer in ‘71. Fun!

Tex goes on to say, "...to wallow in guilt would only create another victim." Yes, Tex, that's right! That’s what we out here want and 12 of your peers wanted—you dead via the Green Room cyanide gas tour. It's amazing how he chooses to forget that NOBODY wanted him alive after October 21, 1971.

The only true statement Tex utters which he may actually believe is this, "In reality, my crime has tentacles that have spread throughout society and affected the lives of hundreds, or thousands, possibly millions of people. What impact has my crime had? It has had a devastating impact."

I, for one, since '69, have never looked at a window screen without thinking of Tex and his bayonet. I'm one person, out of those millions...

Tex declares that "change is possible," yet we know ASPD people do not change. You can't magically concoct a conscience. In his confines in prison, Tex is prevented from doing further harm, but given an opportunity at freedom, and again backed into a corner, Tex would strike out. The only eventual stop gap with ASPDers can be aging and with it a loss of physical strength to harm others. The only 100% “cure” is permanent confinement until death.

Tex states, "Others are proud of my changed life." And by "others" he means prison clergy, his jailhouse cohorts, other delusional bible thumpers and, of course, for a time the daughter of Rosemary/step daughter of Leno LaBianca, Suzan LaBerge, who went off the rails after her parents were killed, and like Patty Hearst I believe for a time was afflicted by Stockholm Syndrome and befriended the killer. I gather she's since regained a brain and no longer is "proud" of Tex Watson.

Tex readily admits that, “My parents and siblings were disgraced by my crime. My Dad painted over the ‘Watson’ name on his store. He went to his grave with the shame of my life, and all of my family members live with it.”

Courtesy afterimagegallery.com

Yes, there is a ton of pride from imaginary people in Tex Watson’s delusional world.

When discussing the overturn of his sentence from Death to Life with the possibility of Parole, Tex says, "Some call it a fluke in the law, but I believe God had another purpose for my life. We need examples of God's forgiveness and grace in these days and times."

My response: delusions of grandeur that could fill the Grand Canyon.

In 1971, the Hippie Kumbaya approach was still alive and well in California and that mindset seeped into the judicial system. The Manson Family killers benefited from that tree-hugger mentality to the detriment of California taxpayers who have shelled out millions to have these killers breathe air since ‘71, and to the unending torture of the victim’s family members who have had to endure endless rounds of parole hearings. California eventually woke up from its hippie daze for the most part, and thank God Governor Jerry Brown knows to veto any ridiculous parole authorizations from the Board...the Kumbaya mindset obviously still lingers there.

Tex has the balls to quote Bible scripture to defend his ordained raison d'etre, "God deliberately chose things the world considers foolish in order to shame those who think they are wise. 1 Corinthians 1:27, NLT."

This translates to: I evaded the Green Room and that proves how stupid you people all are.

Right. Like that's not narcissistic and antisocial at all.

*You need only to remember this quote from Tex to prove how dangerous the sociopath Charles Denton "Tex" Watson still is.* ASPD cannot be cured, people. Ever. Imprisoned until death or the death penalty is the ONLY "cure."

Just when you think Tex cannot offend any further, he starts to lecture the victims and their families by saying, "Victims can easily justify allowing bitterness to grow. They have been hurt tremendously and anger is a natural response of the vindictive nature of mankind. But this does not help or make it right. It will cause cancerous disease and create another victim."

I believe, if you read between the lines here, you have found Tex's ultimate fear—disease, cancer. Well, we know now that Manson killer, Susan Atkins, lost a leg and died from brain cancer. I believe that delusional or not, that is precisely what will be Tex's fate. Just because Tex buys his own piety morph doesn’t mean that his body will be so fooled. Most vicious killers, if you see them decades later, their faces, bodies, end up etched in a visual evil, that over time the mask of normalcy disintegrates and their face and body tell the tale of what is deserved and what is not. Time is ticking for Tex, whether or not he wants to admit it, and his end, like Sadie's, will not be pretty.

Tex admits he blocks out all "attacks" levelled at him, from his parent's ultimate disgrace, to extended family, from the victims' families, and from the world at large. He lives in his own bubble and "...prays for those who make false accusations...", in other words, it's out of his hands so he won't even try to make amends. And we’ve allowed him that luxury because of an overturned Death penalty sentence. It's obscene.

Watson still lives within that “Us vs. Them” mentality that he claims only manifested itself when he was around Manson. That’s another lie, for he states, "I leave my enemies and their misdeeds to God."

Enemies for Tex equate to the victim's family members and anybody who calls him out for the vicious sociopathic killer that he is. He acts as if he's been washed clean of his evil while the rest of us are going to burn in Hell for calling a spade a spade. Why do I feel that Tex will need more sunblock than the rest of us, after death?

His delusions of grandeur know no limit, evinced by his statement, "God understands the angry heart and desires to wrap His loving arms around them. I had an opportunity to wrap my arms around a victim's family member [Suzan LaBerge]”.

Tex literally sees himself as God. Clear sociopathic behaviour and what I think attracted him to Manson in the first place. He saw Charlie playing God and Tex wanted to learn how he could similarly act—ultimate power over all people—a sociopath’s dream come true.

Tex goes on to say that "Yes, some have, [forgiven him] but I can't divulge who all of them are for fear they be persecuted."

To my knowledge, it has only been Suzan and only when she had that lapse in reason. And to my knowledge, she has not maintained a connection with Tex since then, and as I've previously said, most likely regrets having had anything to do with the man.

In this interview, Tex's mind is literally on auto-pilot, spewing out answers that put him in a favourable light, that wholly minimizes the murders and his past actions and ongoing deviant mindset. It is abundantly clear to me that if Watson were ever set free, and if he were ever cornered, he would kill again. I have zero doubt about this.

Watson continues to think as the years go on (and this interview was in '78, 40 years ago now), that, "I pray that God will do more miracles like He did with Suzan and I. As God puts it together, more families will contact me, so that greater healing can take place." Hasn't happened. Won't happen. Ever.

His last kick at the can is backing Restorative Justice. I'm all for that with criminals who are NOT sociopathic. You CANNOT reason with ASPD people. It's been proven that even psychotherapy bolsters their disorder rather than diminishes it because the sociopath ends up manipulating the psychiatrist, not being treated by him. And this ability to manipulate a clinician only increases their ego which, in turn, fuels the narcissism. Imagine an average person going up against such a criminal. They would be victimized all over again. Tex caps this idea off with, "If there is a victim/offender group available, offenders should enroll in it immediately..." Yeah, I bet Tex is all for that. It would be brownie points on his record, that to participate would feign caring on his part, and it would be another juicy opportunity to again emotionally harm, to seek further revenge. It's a win-win for sociopaths. Hell, he even writes in to Wikipedia to get changes made on his bio. Tex will NEVER STOP trying to manipulate.

The best and only reparation for victims of such deviant killers is to insure they are NEVER allowed any stage—TV, radio, magazine/newspaper interviews or online—as limelight of any kind only fuels their behaviour and create further public harm. The prison system is, for the most part, wise to sociopathic behaviour; for example, Dennis Rader, the BTK serial killer in Wichita, Kansas, is under orders never to be publicly interviewed or allowed to see himself on TV or in the media. You take away their ability to shine and spew their camouflaged vitriol and sociopaths eventually shrivel up. That, my friends, is the only justice we get from these monsters, short of the Death penalty.

Comments

louis365 said…
I don't think it's right to call Tex a sociopath. He doesn't fit the bill. Unlike say, Scott Peterson. Or that Saskatchewan politician, Colin Thatcher. They are true sociopaths.
B.J. Thompson said…
Hi, louis,

Thank you for your comment, louis.

However, Tex, Charlie, Katie and Sadie were all clinically diagnosed with ASPD. Remember, many sociopaths are not monstrous looking/acting. What they all are, are egocentric, narcissistic, opportunistic and highly manipulative, and in the right cornered circumstances, can and will kill. I'm afraid Tex more than qualifies for the DSM-5 if you know his background.
louis365 said…
OK....I think we are having some mis-communaka. Tex being anti-social does not make him a sociopath. I don't think any of them were sociopaths. They just don't fit the criteria.

In the meantime, I don't think people can always be put into a "slot". Some peoples "problems" are made...by their environments.
B.J. Thompson said…
Hello again, louis,

Antisocial Personality Disorder IS the clinical term for sociopathy/psychopathy. The latter terms are NOT clinical terms. They are lay monikers used to describe ASPD characteristics as per being environmentally/from birth affected.

I reference sociopathy, and not psychopathy, in Tex's case because it is my belief he was altered by his environment, and well before Manson, and not just from birth.

In psychological terms, people can be "slotted", as you say, ASPD via a clinical psychologist, as was done in the case with Tex, Sadie and Katie. I cannot remember if Leslie was similarly diagnosed.

Whether liking this terminology or not does not distract from the fact the these killers were, and are to this very day, ASPD.

To date, there is no "cure" for this mental disorder once that mindset has reached adulthood. In recent times, some children in their formative years have been successfully treated insofar as their harmful inclinations have been eliminated, but often the dissociative characteristics - that of not feeling true empathy towards others - will remain.

I'm sorry you're having trouble with this louis but this is the fact in Tex's case. Could his deviant narcissistic ways have been corrected if he had earlier treatment? Maybe. But we are left with the fact that no such help was ever asked for or given prior to August 9th, 1969, and at least 7 people are dead due to his actions.

Just recently, Tex states that Patricia, aka Katie, killed Abigail Folger and that Tex just "assisted", when we know via the autopsy report that it was ONLY Tex's bayonet which caused the fatal wounds.

I mention this to show you that even to present day, Tex is shirking responsibility as is always the case with ASPDers.
louis365 said…
Barbara....Your sounding like you have studied psychology. Then there is NO WAY we are going to agree :)

You might be a good guest to have on Brian's program. Ever consider calling in?
B.J. Thompson said…
Hi again, louis,

Lol...hey, that's cool. I'm not here to convince. I have no agenda. I'm here to deliver facts.

I assisted Brian when he, along with Catscraddle, interviewed with Bill Garretson.I have no desire for media attention.

This has been a quiet research undertaking for me since 1978 when the first of The Family came up for parole - Sadie.

I have done considerable psychological research as per ASPD, yes, and specifically to these killers, yes.

Many people cant wrap their head around people that present as a calm unsuspecting humane person and think/act out in deviant ways as a monster would. Thats their key to success. They rely on us not suspecting.

Thank you for your comments, louis, always welcome, in agreement or not! :-D
louis365 said…
lol..Oh well...still think you'd be a good guest, but if you don't want to...

This will probably be Brian's last year. I get the feeling he's ready to move on. He's in his seventh year now...time for him to get out. He really doesn't want to be associated with people like Channels and Boner.

He said something, a few weeks back, about returning to network radio. Something like that.
B.J. Thompson said…
Aw, thanks, louis...

It's not a matter of wanting, really; moreso, to keep in line with my original mission - that of presenting what I've gleaned over the decades. No grandstanding, no hype, no hidden agenda. Once there was this technology, I decided to present what I've found, that's all. I'm not in this for notoriety or to make one red cent.

Hey, I don't blame Brian one bit. There are a bunch of agenda-driven "Charliemites", as I call them, out there...Brian has done his stint. I'd return to mainstream radio, too, if I were him.

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L to R: Charles Manson - Charles "Tex" Watson - Bobby Beausoleil - Bruce Davis - Susan Atkins - Patricia Krenwinkel - Leslie van Houten